[Former Member]

Another voice for this discussion with food for thought:

https://paddlingmag.com/stories/columns/rock-the-boat/certification-killed-paddling-adventures/

[Nancy More]

Hi Daniel

I am going to wade in late on this.

My experience in industrial safety and kayaking lead me to believe that there are no accidents.  There are a series of events and choices that lead to incidents that become notable or cause injury or loss.   So, you choose every day things that may or may not contribute to your safety.  They start way before you get on the water.

You choose whether or not to check your boat at the start of the season or before a big trip.  You choose what equipment to carry in your repair kit.  You choose whether to learn how to manage your boat with and without the use of a rudder.   You choose to learn to understand wind, water, and waves and make appropriate choices. That might make the difference between inconvenience (something breaks that you can fix on a beach easily),  something that causes you minor discomfort (you have to paddle for the day without the benefit of seat back support) or something that causes you to have to call in help and and cancel a long trip.

My first overnight kayak trip was 14 days from Fair Harbour to the Brooks.  Lots of open water and opportunities to learn.  Knowing what I know now, that probably wasn’t the smartest choice, but we were 4 people with extensive back-country hiking experience and sound decision-making skills.  I remember being terrified at at least one point.  And I know that we spent at least one afternoon on the beach as we waited for the evening calm to continue on down the coast.

Someone has already addressed the probability versus impact risk management matrix.  It works.  You mitigate the items that are high risk and high probability though specific planning and equipment.  You have to be aware of the “black swans” that can cause serious injuries and fatalities and can’t be predicted.  Basic safety (wear a PFD, wear a dry or wet suit in big and cold water, carry a radio, get some education) means you have the capability of dealing with most things.

Each of us have our own risk tolerance.  As you point out, the more you know and the more experience you have, makes you aware of the possibilities.  It also gives you the capability and skills to deal with those possibilities.  So, yes, people go out and they do things without the requisite understanding and equipment and  they get away with them, or not.  They are lucky, or not.  And people with a lot of experience and knowledge are sometimes in the wrong place at the wrong time, like the recent avalanche deaths in Alberta.    And some people never leave the beach.

[Former Member]

A little bump here. I’ll be around next weekend (June 8-9) if anyone wants to take her for a test paddle.

 

And in case you need help making your mind up, I’ll just leave this here: https://paddling.com/gear/mariner-kayaks-inc-mariner-ii-1-kayak/

 

Happy spring!

[Kevin Amos]

Thank you all for your responses. They have been very helpful.

I have a follow up question specific to the Standard Horizon YCE15 software. Have any of you used to to import waypoints. I understand Marine Trails allows members to export gpx or klm files.

Thanks

[Philip Kubik]

I would be careful to distinguish between challenge and risk of injury or death. Although I agree that challenge is important for growth, I don’t agree that risk of injury or death is necessary for growth, at least not for me. Personally, I am convinced that I would enjoy kayaking even more than I do if it were completely free of that type of risk. On the other hand, there are those who say that they enjoy the adrenaline rush of a risky experience.

[Former Member]

A new battery pack i heard of

 

 

https://www.amazon.ca/talentcell/s?k=talentcell

[Former Member]

Thanks very much for the information Katya.

Unfortunately a family health issue arose and I was unable to make the trip.

My colleagues reported that it is a beautiful area, hopefully I’ll get an opportunity to go someday.

Thanks again

 

[Yekaterina Yushmanova]

Just came back from there. You can camp on Spring Is at the West Coast Expedition’s site (on the north side of the island), they won’t be using it until June. There is a sign at the site asking for a donation if you are staying there. I recommend taking the water taxi out as the inlet is a bit of slog and if winds blow up it will be too much for a beginner. If you get calm weather, the Mission group is lovely.

No wildlife warnings at Rugged as of Saturday. We stayed at the South beach and hiked to the North one – very easy short hike. While protected from the SE, the north beach is very exposed to northerlies and was actually quite rough when we went there. I wouldn’t recommend crossing the Kyuquot channel with a beginner to get there.

The estuary around Fair Harbour is pretty and sheltered but is a very short paddle.

Feel free to text or call if you want any more details)

604.600.3738 Katya

 

 

[Yekaterina Yushmanova]

I have an Anker power bank for all USB compatible devices and it is awesome for that. Doesn’t work with the the radios though, so looking forward to see what others are using fo that purpose.

[Yekaterina Yushmanova]

You would enter the first option as:

050° 01.560 – 124° 49.535 (add a zero in front where needed)

or second

050° 01.56 -124° 49.54 (round up the seconds, less precise)

Correct?

 

[Mick Allen]

Two similar answers:

1) too much safety is when the ‘safety’ eliminates too much of the challenge/risk.  We need challenge to grow.

2) too much safety is when the ‘safety’ has minimal failure event impact. Some good examples of this are:  a) pfd for everyone – huge impact on failure events, so great. b) heaving line for everyone – minimal impact on failure events, so too much.

 

[Former Member]

@Nick: I, too, have the HX870. Kevin’s list of location formats is correct

ddd°mm.mmm
ddd°mm.mm
ddd°mm’ss”

There is no decimal degrees option.

[Nick Heath]

First: thank for asking an easy question, Kevin. Often our Forum questions are imponderable! However, I hope you meant the first option was ddd.ddddd as Martin assumed, not as you wrote i.e. “ddd°mm.mmm”,

Second: thanks for a succinct, accurate answer, Martin. Right on!

Third: Increasingly, I find degrees and decimal degrees is the preferred format in use – it is the standard in aviation. It reduces the confusion over what units are in use (in radio communications especially and avoids dividing/multiplying by 60. The bad part is that it is harder to use with a nautical chart, because it doesn’t give the minutes which are clearly given on charts, so it is harder to quickly locate the correct point from a given coordinate.

Most sailors, mariners and I prefer ddd mm.mmm – degrees are separated from minutes but we don’t bother with seconds – we just use a decimal of a minute. This is a practical hybrid format that works well with marine charts.

The last option uses seconds instead of decimal minutes and I think this is too confusing for people although it is time-honoured and traditional. I find I make more mistakes over units when using this format. However, the Govt of Canada sticks doggedly to this older format for issuing notices etc so you need to know what it is and how to convert.

The great part about these machines (GPS, plotters etc) is that they don’t really care and can instantly convert from one to another format, so I often re-set my GPS to another of these formats to capture a new waypoint given to me in a format that I don’t currently use – then I switch the machine back and everything is converted into my preferred format, whatever that might be.

Sorry – my explanation was far from succinct!

[Chris Dennis]

Kevin, try the converter attached.  https://www.fcc.gov/media/radio/dms-decimal

It’s a bit clunky to do serveal of these but, with patience, it gets the job done.

 

 

[Former Member]

The first map coords format is ddd.ddddd (i.e., decimal degrees) which is not an option on your radio.

The second format is ddd°mm.mmm (i.e., degrees and decimal minutes) which is the first option on your radio. (It is also the second radio option but with lower precision.)

FYI, the third radio format is degrees, minutes and seconds.

[Author]

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